Finding Hope in Church Closures

My Conversation with Rev. Lorrin Radzik

When I first sat down with Reverend Lorrin Radzik, I knew this conversation was going to be different. We had talked a few weeks prior, but this time, we dove even deeper into one of the toughest aspects of ministry—church closures. Lorrin is someone who has walked through the experience more than once, and her story isn’t just about saying goodbye to a dying church. It’s about finding hope and purpose in the midst of endings.

What struck me most about our conversation was how Lorrin approaches something that could easily feel like failure. Pastors are taught to build up our congregations, to nurture them, to help them grow. But what happens when the opposite is true? What happens when a church’s time comes to an end, and you're the one tasked with leading it through that final chapter? That’s a tough calling, and not one many would want to take on repeatedly.

But Lorrin doesn’t shy away from it. In fact, she’s found a way to see the beauty in those final days. We talked about the idea of a “good death” for churches—the concept that just because a church is closing, doesn’t mean it didn’t fulfill its mission. Sometimes, a church has done all it was meant to do, and it’s time to let go. That’s not failure; that’s completion.

Lorrin shared how one of the churches she served had this daycare ministry that, while well-intentioned and meaningful, wasn’t enough to sustain the church itself. The congregation loved the daycare, and it served the community well, but the church was still in decline. The hard reality was that the finances, the numbers, and the energy weren’t there to keep things going. As painful as it was, she had to lead them through the realization that no amount of duct tape or effort would change that.

What I appreciated most was how Lorrin reframed the situation for the people she served. She helped them see that their church’s legacy didn’t end with the closure. The lives they touched, the ministries they supported, and even the memories they created were part of a legacy that would continue in new and different ways. One thing that stood out was when she talked about members of that closed church still meeting to this day. They’ve formed a small community, still praying and supporting each other outside the walls of a traditional church building.

We also talked about the emotional toll these closures take. It’s not just about numbers and finances; it’s about people’s lives, their histories, and their deep connections to these sacred spaces. Lorrin shared a particularly raw moment when she walked into her office one Sunday morning to find her degrees smashed on the floor and her coffee sabotaged. Someone was angry—angry that their church was closing, angry at Lorrin for being the one to guide them through it. That kind of rage can make you question your calling, but Lorrin held onto her faith and continued loving those people, even when it was hard.

She talked about how resurrection is messy and often unrecognizable, referencing how even Jesus looked different post-resurrection. Lorrin encouraged her congregations to embrace the idea that while their church may close, the resurrection of their ministry could look different, unexpected, and maybe even better than they imagined.

This conversation with Lorrin left me thinking about the broader picture of ministry. Communities are changing, attendance is shrinking, and the old ways of doing things aren’t working anymore. But maybe that’s okay. Maybe it’s time for us to stop clinging to what was and start looking for where new life is springing up. It might not look like we expect. It might mean saying goodbye to beloved buildings and traditions. But if we trust in resurrection, we know that God is still at work—even in the endings.

If you’ve ever been part of a church that’s in decline, or if you’re a pastor facing tough decisions about your congregation’s future, I hope this episode and this conversation with Lorrin will give you some comfort. Endings are hard, but they aren’t the end of the story. Resurrection is coming—it just might look different than we expect.

Thanks for reading, and as always, feel free to share your thoughts in the comments or connect with me on social media. Let’s keep this conversation going.

The Reality of Dying Churches: Insights from Gail Cafferata

As a podcast host exploring the challenges facing modern churches, I recently had the privilege of interviewing Gail Cafferata, author of "The Last Pastor" and a retired Episcopal priest who closed a church. Our conversation shed light on the often-overlooked realities of dying churches and the toll they take on pastors.

Gail's unique perspective as both a researcher and a pastor who's been through church closure herself offered invaluable insights. She surveyed over 100 pastors who have closed churches, uncovering patterns and challenges that many face in silence.

One striking revelation was the emotional impact of leading a dying church. Gail found that 65% of pastors experienced high stress levels, and many struggled with feelings of guilt, shame, and failure. This emotional toll often extends to their careers, with some pastors facing difficulties finding new positions after closure.

Gail introduced me to the concept of "differentiation" - the ability for pastors to maintain healthy boundaries between themselves and their congregations. This skill becomes crucial when leading a dying church, allowing pastors to guide the process without becoming overwhelmed by the congregation's emotions.

Perhaps most importantly, Gail emphasized that a dying church doesn't have to be a failure. She spoke about what constitutes a "good death" for a congregation, including:

1. Celebrating the church's legacy and impact

2. Providing pastoral care for members and leaders

3. Finding ways for the church's mission to continue through its members in new contexts

As we face the reality of declining church attendance and more congregations facing closure, Gail's research and experiences offer a roadmap for navigating these challenging times with grace and hope.

For those interested in diving deeper into this topic, I highly recommend checking out Gail's book, "The Last Pastor," or listening to our full conversation on The Last Service podcast.

Have you experienced or witnessed a church closure? How did it impact you or your community? Share your thoughts in the comments below.

Rethinking Church: Lessons from Urban Sky's Innovative Ministry Model

As the host of a podcast exploring the future of the church, I've had the privilege of speaking with many insightful leaders. Recently, I sat down with Mike Sares, director of Urban Skye, and our conversation left me with fresh perspectives on ministry in today's world.

Urban Skye: A New Approach to Ministry

Urban Skye isn't your typical church organization. Instead, it acts as an umbrella for what Mike calls "freelance pastors." These are individuals called to ministries that don't fit neatly within traditional church structures. From counseling missionaries to reaching out to touring musicians, Urban Sky supports a diverse array of faith entrepreneurs.

What struck me most was Urban Skye's emphasis on entering people's worlds rather than expecting them to enter the church's. Mike shared stories of hanging out in goth clubs and attending punk concerts - not typical pastor behavior, but crucial for building authentic relationships.

Lessons for Declining Churches

As someone who often speaks with leaders of struggling churches, I was particularly interested in what declining congregations could learn from Urban Skye's model. Mike's advice was simple but profound: start doing things differently.

He emphasized the need to spend time in the culture, befriending people who would never step inside a church building. It's about relationships first, not programs or services. This approach requires humility and a willingness to decrease so that new ministries can increase.

Embracing Failure and Experimentation

One of the most refreshing aspects of our conversation was Mike's attitude toward failure. In a church culture often fixated on success and growth, Urban Skye sees failure as essential. As Mike put it, "Failure is not an option; it's essential to whatever God is doing in your hearts as a church."

This willingness to experiment and potentially fail allows for innovation and growth in ways that playing it safe never could. It's a mindset I believe more churches need to adopt.

Final Thoughts

My conversation with Mike Sares left me energized and hopeful about the future of ministry. While traditional church structures may be declining in many places, innovative models like Urban Skye show that the spirit of Christ's mission is alive and well.

As we navigate the changing landscape of faith in the 21st century, leaders like Mike remind us of the importance of authenticity, relationships, and a willingness to color outside the lines. These principles, I believe, will be crucial for the church's future vitality.

What are your thoughts on innovative ministry models like Urban Sky? I'd love to hear your perspectives in the comments below.

The Jubilee Program: An Innovative Solution for Struggling Churches

In recent years, we've seen a troubling trend of church closures across America. It's estimated that over 4,000 churches will close this year alone. But what if there was a way to preserve these churches' legacies and assets while transitioning them to new ministries? That's exactly what the Jubilee Program, created by the Southern Baptist of Texas Foundation, aims to do.

I recently interviewed Bart McDonald from the Southern Baptist of Texas Foundation about this groundbreaking initiative. The Jubilee Program offers a lifeline to struggling churches, helping them make good endings and embrace new beginnings.

What is the Jubilee Program?

Named after the biblical concept of Jubilee found in Leviticus and Deuteronomy, this program allows dying churches to transfer their property to the foundation. The foundation then renovates the property and transfers it to new ministries or congregations.

As McDonald explains, "We don't want to hold a Jubilee property in our possession any longer than it takes to get it back into the hands of the local New Testament church."

How It Works

The process typically unfolds like this:

1. A struggling church reaches out to the foundation.

2. The foundation assesses the church's financial situation and the viability of the location as a preaching point.

3. If accepted into the program, the church transfers its assets to the foundation.

4. The foundation pays off any existing debt and renovates the property.

5. A new ministry or congregation is identified to take over the property or the existing congregation begins to revitalize.

6. The new or existing church buys back the property at an affordable rate, ensuring their financial stability.

Success Stories

McDonald shared several success stories, including Maplewood Baptist Church. This predominantly white congregation had dwindled to just 25 members in a diversifying neighborhood. Through the Jubilee Program, the property was transferred to a thriving Black church plant called Creekside, which is now better positioned to minister to the changing community.

More Than Just Real Estate

What sets the Jubilee Program apart is its pastoral approach. McDonald emphasizes the importance of encouraging struggling churches: "The first thing I do with that group is I want to tell them that God is not in any way disappointed with them, that they're not failing."

This compassionate perspective, combined with sound financial principles, makes the Jubilee Program a unique and effective solution for church revitalization.

Lessons for All Churches

While the Jubilee Program is currently only available in Texas, there are lessons here for churches everywhere:

1. Don't wait too long to ask for help. Many churches approach the foundation when their resources are already severely depleted.

2. Be open to new models of ministry. Sometimes the best way to preserve a church's legacy is by passing the baton to a new congregation better suited to reach the current community.

3. Remember that church buildings are tools for ministry, not ends in themselves. The goal is always to advance God's kingdom, even if that means significant changes.

Conclusion

The Jubilee Program offers a hopeful model for addressing the crisis of church closures. By combining financial expertise with a kingdom-minded perspective, it's helping to ensure that valuable ministry assets aren't lost. As McDonald puts it, "If God's people will get together and prayerfully seek the face of God, it's been my experience that God's people will almost always do the right thing."

For struggling churches, the message is clear: there is hope, and there are options. Don't be afraid to reach out for help. Your church's greatest days of ministry impact might still be ahead – even if they look different than you imagined.

Revitalizing the Modern Church: A Journey from Decline to Renewal

In today's rapidly changing cultural landscape, traditional churches face unprecedented challenges. Many are witnessing a gradual decline in attendance and engagement, particularly in secularized cities. This was the case for a historic church in Seattle, led by Verlon Fosner, who shared his experience on the Last Service Podcast.

From Thriving to Declining: Understanding the Shift

When Verlon and his team took over a century-old church in Seattle, they initially saw growth, with attendance records being broken and multiple services offered. However, around 2004-2005, they noticed a significant downturn, despite their best efforts. The church, once vibrant, began to experience a decline that left the leadership team searching for answers.

The Role of Secularization in Church Decline

Seattle, like many other cities in the Pacific Northwest, is highly secularized, with only about 5% of the population attending church regularly. This reality led Verlon to pursue further studies in the UK, where he learned about the effects of secularization on churches. The insights gained from his time in Oxford were invaluable, helping him understand the root cause of the decline: the church was designed for a population that no longer existed in large numbers.

Embracing a New Approach: The Dinner Church Model

Faced with the reality of their situation, Verlon and his team made a bold decision to rethink their approach to church. They realized that their traditional methods were not resonating with the secularized population of Seattle. This led to the birth of the Dinner Church model, a concept inspired by the early Christian church's practice of gathering around tables to share meals and discuss the teachings of Jesus.

The shift to the Dinner Church model was not easy. It required a significant change in mindset, moving away from the "church business" to focus on the "rescue business"—reaching out to those who are lost and disconnected from faith. This approach resonated deeply with the community, bringing in people who had previously been uninterested in traditional church services.

The Impact: A Revival of Community and Faith

The results of this transformation were remarkable. Within months, the Dinner Church saw an influx of attendees from the local neighborhood, many of whom had never set foot in a traditional church. This model proved to be more than just an innovative approach; it was a return to the roots of Christian fellowship and evangelism, focusing on building relationships and sharing the message of Jesus in a way that was accessible and relevant to the modern, secularized world.

Key Takeaways for Modern Churches

Verlon's story offers valuable lessons for churches grappling with similar challenges. The key to revitalizing a declining church lies in understanding the cultural context and being willing to adapt. By returning to the basics of Christian fellowship and focusing on genuine community engagement, churches can find new ways to connect with those who have drifted away from faith.

Keywords: church decline, secularization, Dinner Church, church revitalization, modern church challenges, community engagement, Christian fellowship.

The Vital Role of Small Churches in Today’s Faith Landscape: My Conversation with Karl Vaters

As I reflect on my conversation with Karl Vaters, I can't help but think about the countless small churches around the world, often overlooked yet vital to the Christian faith. In a time when megachurches seem to dominate the narrative, Karl's insights were a powerful reminder of the importance of small congregations, especially when many pastors are struggling with the fear of leading what they perceive as a dying church.

Rethinking Church Growth

One of the most impactful moments in our discussion was when Karl talked about the misconception surrounding church growth. Like many pastors in the 1980s, Karl was swept up in the church growth movement, emphasizing that bigger was always better. The idea was that if you followed the right strategies, your church would inevitably grow in size. But after years of ministry, Karl came to a sobering realization—growth isn’t guaranteed, even when you do everything "right."

This struck a chord with me. How often have we equated a thriving church with a growing congregation, only to feel like we're failing when our numbers don't match our expectations? Karl’s story reassured me that a small church doesn't equate to a dying church. Many small churches are healthier and more spiritually vibrant than their larger counterparts.

The Strength of Small Churches

Karl shared that 90% of churches worldwide have fewer than 200 members. This statistic was eye-opening but even more powerful was Karl's point that small churches play a critical role in regions where Christianity thrives. These congregations may not have the resources or visibility of larger churches, but they possess a unique strength in their close-knit communities. The relationships in these churches are often deeper, the pastoral care more personal, and the spiritual growth more intentional.

Shifting the Focus from Size to Health

Karl’s message challenged me to rethink how we define success in ministry. Historically, the church focused on pastoral care, biblical teaching, and building genuine community rather than on growing numbers. Somewhere along the line, we lost that focus, especially in the American context. Karl advocates for a return to these roots, urging pastors to prioritize the health of their congregations over their size.

This shift in perspective is not only liberating but also necessary. It’s easy to get caught up in the numbers game, but Karl reminds us that a small, healthy church can have just as much, if not more, impact than a large one. Small churches are often where real spiritual growth happens because of their intimate and supportive environments.

Resources for Small Churches

Karl is passionate about providing resources specifically designed for small churches. He pointed out that most church resources are geared towards larger congregations, which can leave small church pastors feeling even more isolated. Karl's work is filling that gap, offering practical tools and strategies catering to small churches' unique challenges.

Conclusion

My conversation with Karl Vaters was a much-needed reminder that small churches are not dying churches. In many cases, they are the lifeblood of the global Christian community. By shifting our focus from numbers to health, we can ensure that our ministries are spiritually fulfilling and impactful, no matter the size of our congregations.

If you’re feeling the pressure of leading a "dying church," I hope Karl’s insights encourage you as much as they did me. Small churches matter, and so does your work within them. Together, we can contribute to the broader growth of the Christian Church, one small but significant step at a time.